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Debra Woog-Crisis Navigation Partner; Difficult Conversations Expert

Debra Woog

Transcript

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Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:00:02] Hello Everybody. This is Nicky Asher-Bowling. From motherhood unfiltered is going to be okay. And today’s guest is Debra Woog. So, whether you’re experiencing your own crises or managing others throughout, there’s she is a crisis navigation partner and can help you determine your goals. Express. Hold on here. Express, you know, complicated situations. So, and before I bring her on, I just want to remind everybody that if you’re watching this on YouTube to like comment and subscribe if you haven’t already. And that will help with the algorithm getting more people to see it. And if you listen on any podcast platform, then please go to Apple at. Apple and then you can write a review there. I don’t know of any other podcast platform that where you can rate your podcast. So, now let me bring Debra on So, we can get to know her. Hi, Debra.

Debra Woog [00:01:34] Good morning. Good afternoon. Yeah.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:01:40] So, Debra, just tell us a little bit about being a crisis navigation partner and how you got started being a crisis navigation partner.

Debra Woog [00:01:55] Okay. So, I have a crisis navigation partner, which is a profession that I basically made up. So, if you haven’t heard of this before, you’re in great company with most of the 7 billion plus people in the world. So, I created the concept of a crisis navigation partner because I have been both a leader and a leadership consultant and coach in situations where I’ve been in crisis or when I was the consultant or coach, where my clients have been in crisis, where they’ve been. And I’ve been a woman who’s a leader and feeling on my own for Some reason, and my clients have been to either because they’re single or they’re only children of the only adult child of parents that they need to take care of, or they are at the top of an organization. It can be lonely at the time; I know for sure. My role is to be that person that I wish that I had and Some of the difficult things that I went through, especially my child’s mental health crisis. Mm hmm. My role is to be that person for my clients where I can provide emotional support combined with practical support. So, I do research on behalf of my clients. I help them strategize for difficult conversations and a lot of listening and teasing out what are the pain points that are personal and what are the pain points that are situational, and how can we guide your way through to the best possible outcome of the situation?

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:03:35] Wow. That’s interesting. I, I love that you. Well, first of all, I didn’t realize that you created this role. And, I mean, how smart is that? I don’t nobody else has done that. So, but I mean, they have Someone that you can reach out to when you’re, you know, in the middle of a crisis. Like, I know when I went through my divorce, I would have loved to have Somebody there to help me with that, you know, because I yeah, I was a stay-at-home mom, you know, and I ended up with having three little boys and. I don’t. The first thing I could think of was, well, I need to get a job. But if I’d had Someone help me, then I could have helped. You know, not only find a job, but also, help the boys transition from being a two-parent home to a one parent home and all of that. It just seems like we. Are always like putting out fires, you know, and stuff like that happens. And then our loved ones are being put to the backburner because we’re just trying to take care of their basic, basic, you know, their basic needs. So, and So, I really love that. So, how So, kind of explain the steps, you know, like more interest if Someone is lost a loved one and they reach out to you. So, what would be the first thing that you would want to look at?

Debra Woog [00:05:15] Well, initially, I always have a no cost conversation to understand what’s going on for the person and to see how I think I might be able to help these be what they’re looking for. Sometimes it seems like I can’t help, and sometimes it seems like I’m not the right person in those cases. I’m always happy to refer them to Someone else. I have a big connector. I have a network of brilliant women who can provide a lot of different services. So, it starts with kind of the assessment piece. What’s your current situation and what is your ideal best possible outcome given this difficult situation that you’re in?

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:06:03] Oh, okay. I really like that doing an assessment and. I. And Sometimes if Someone’s like me, they’re probably go, I don’t know what the best possible outcome is. You know, because how do you think of that when you’ve lost Somebody, you know?

Debra Woog [00:06:21] Yeah. So, taking that right, I mean, the best possible outcome would be brought them back to life. Okay. I don’t have that power that is not in the job description I made up for myself, although if I had the power, I’d put it right. Other people would like it. I would like it. So, yeah.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:06:38] She’s doing God’s work now.

Debra Woog [00:06:39] So, you. No, I would. I what I do is work with people to define success at this phase of their life. Yeah. And how can they leverage their unique brilliance So, their best skills and interests and qualities, their top needs, their top values, their priorities, how do they leverage all that to create the next phase of life without this person? What kind of support do they need? Right. Kind of. Access. What are the toughest things going on right now? What wouldn’t like that load? What are the big decisions that you’re facing? So, I can’t do that magical thing, right? To help ease Someone into the next phase. And I can help them understand grief better, although I’m not a grief counselor. Go through that before. Right. It’s not linear and it takes So, many different phases and they don’t necessarily go in order. And though Elizabeth Kubler-Ross had all the right ideas and there even she said they didn’t always go from there. Yeah.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:07:53] That’s right.

Debra Woog [00:07:55] So, I see myself as a thought partner as well as an extra pair of hands. I studied psychology in college and then I went to business school. I was an organizational change consultant and a leadership and career consultant for. It’s been 25 years now since I graduated from business school.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:08:14] Right. Right.

Debra Woog [00:08:15] Bringing my own skills and expertise to bear is having gone through all my own difficult situations. I just know how painful it is to be on your own. And Some people have family and friends who can help them through these kinds of things, and that’s great. And people don’t for whatever reason then.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:08:35] Yeah, I do agree with that. I find it more and more that there are people that just don’t have Someone they can turn to. I don’t know if it’s just because they’re not close to people, you know, to their family or whatever. But like for me, I would I know how busy my family is. I would not want to burden them with Something. So, I would probably. Want to reach out and ask for help.  So, what kind of crises have you faced in your life or in your work? I mean, obviously, this is a personal thing for you because you decided to change your whole career to help other people.

Debra Woog [00:09:28] Yeah. I mean, I was I like to think I was helping other people in that, you know, in the earlier parts of my career, too. But I must hone-in one more specifically. That was a switch. It was a clarification for me. But to answer your question, starting with as a kid, my family moved around because of my dad’s job nine times by the time, got more.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:09:53] Of.

Debra Woog [00:09:54] A lot of the United States, and we were constantly having to start over. And, you know, when you’re a kid and you get taken away from your friends, that’s a kind of crisis on its own. Yeah. So, you know, it’s not a tragedy, but it’s hard. Yeah. I have the experience of starting over and building a new community. I mean, I’ve experience of starting over a lot.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:10:19] Yeah. Yeah.

Debra Woog [00:10:21] As I went into my twenties, I lost my best friend from business school to now. I lost my best friend from high school right after I was in business school to AIDS. And before that he had become very suddenly ill, and I helped him, and his partner identify potential treatment options for the diagnosis. Yeah, well, yeah, within that because AIDS is a collection of things, right? I went through that. I got married. I had kids. Those were great things. I got divorced. I became a single mom. My child of two just turned 18 yesterday and in November it’ll be 14 years. Yeah. So, I’ve been a single mom on my own during that time. My Son was diagnosed with type one diabetes, and then my daughter, a few years later, started having severe generalized anxiety disorder now. So, those are Some examples of the crises I’ve personally had. I’ve been very fortunate in a lot of ways in life that I haven’t had a lot more loss people in my life who were younger.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:11:40] Right. I find it interesting that sometimes we go through things, you know, as a child or as a young adult that helps us, like you said, like hone in our redefine our purpose. And those things have helped you with your own personal journey and you and your children, you know, So, and they are better off for it, you know, because you already practiced this in your life. It just makes it easier to help Someone else who’s in the middle of a crisis. And I just really love that concept. I know, like I’ve said before, there’s lots of people that don’t, you know, have Somebody. And I feel like we just need to get this message out there that, hey, you’re not alone. You know, we’ve got Someone here that can help you in this moment of your crisis.  So, what was the defining moment that you were like, this is what I got to be doing. I got to help people when they’re in the middle of a crisis. Was that a defining moment or was it just the, you know, slow revelation or, you know, how did that happen?

Debra Woog [00:13:00] Exactly. Kind of a sudden revelation. It is. Going back to your question about types of crises before. I’ve also, been through my own existential crises. And, you know, what am I doing here? What is my purpose? And I am living where people need me. And I’m I filled from my work. Right. I’ve also, been downsized. You know, I’ve been laid off. I have overseen human resources for a company where I had to lay everybody else off. Gosh, I’ve been through disputes. I’ve coached a lot of other people through various kinds of disputes. So, back to your question now. In around 2017, I started my business in 1999. Around 2017, I went through a kind of a phase that I think I’ve been through. That’s kind of the third time I’ve been through where I felt like, I love having my business. I’m successful. I like my work. But it’s not lighting me up like it used to. I know like what to do. And I am So, excited to show up every day to do it.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:14:06] Yeah.

Debra Woog [00:14:07] Yeah. Well, it wasn’t energizing me the way it used to.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:14:11] Right. Right. Oh, I totally get that.

Debra Woog [00:14:14] And so, I used the tools that I used as a career coach with my clients, some of which had come because I use them in the past in my own existential crises, to think about what would success look and feel like for me, and what were the times in my life that I felt most alive? Most useful.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:14:39] Right?

Debra Woog [00:14:40] Most fulfilled. Mm. And I started making lists. And then I was looking at this whole list of things I went through that Some of them were related to my business and Some of them weren’t new things that I had gone through as a friend or as a loved one of Somebody else.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:14:58] Right.

Debra Woog [00:14:59] And I was like, holy cow. I had have kind of, um, like, there’s been a lot of crisis in my life and in my friends lives. And I am one of these weirdos who kind of goes towards not away from.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:15:15] Your friends or danger.

Debra Woog [00:15:18] I mean, I go tours, like, bungee jumping or anything, but I don’t mean that I don’t love adventure. I’m not a thrill seeker. My dad was a volunteer EMT when I was like that used to bring home the ambulance. Sometimes it was very little like two and three. I remember being. But what my dad to this day listens to a police scanner to relax. I don’t do that. But if Somebody I deeply care about is having an emergency and they come to me, I stop what I’m doing.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:15:55] Right.

Debra Woog [00:15:56] And my dad would, like, follow a fire truck from a safe distance just to watch and see what’s on fire and how they never live. I want to be there for other people. And. I just realized how many times it had come up in situations that I was not creating. I mean, I contributed to my divorce operations in the lives of my clients and friends and family that. It wasn’t making happen. But then when they came and said, I want you by my side during this week.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:16:31] So, yeah.

Debra Woog [00:16:32] Asked me, have asked me to be the executor of their wills. Yeah, I know. And I was going to like. So, you want me in your crisis when you’ve left because.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:16:45] They want you to pick up the pieces.

Debra Woog [00:16:48] I started asking people like, why did you come to me during that? Why, right? Why do you want me to be here in those situations? And I am listening to the themes and that aha moment. Help me. Okay, I get it. What I want to do. And then I had to think about, well, what’s the name for this? Because that’s this thing. And I wanted to be clearer that I wasn’t. Your garden variety career coach or life coach has never resonated with me for my for my work.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:17:23] But yeah.

Debra Woog [00:17:24] For the business coach more than being a leadership coach.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:17:29] Yeah, I love that people are seeing you as a a standard or a pillar, you know, a strong foundation. And they know that even though they may be flying in the wind, they can, you know, link arms with Debra and Debra will hold them, hold on to them, you know, and guide them through the next step that they need to go through. I, I feel like each time well, I would think that each time you would help Somebody that you probably learn Something new. Oh yeah. And, you know, you’re just still continuing to learn and to help others, you know, with the next quiet. The other thing I wanted to mention, and I think it just left my brain because that’s the way it is.

Debra Woog [00:18:22] But I have a thought to mention, if you want, while you’re thinking about what.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:18:27] Yeah, go ahead.

Debra Woog [00:18:30] As I was putting together my kind of own manifesto, but my own ideas about how I wanted to serve and who I wanted to serve. Right. In a crisis, there’s kind of two different roles. Mm hmm. I don’t think that people talk about this in this way. So, again, I made up the language of, you know, better language for this. Please tell me this is what I’m using. In the meantime, you’ve got it in, you’re in a crisis. You are the person zero who’s got kind of the ground zero, the person right in the center of it. This thing is happening to you. You’re getting divorced. You’re lying in the hospital bed. You just got laid off.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:19:08] Yeah.

Debra Woog [00:19:09] Diagnosis, Something like that.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:19:10] Yeah.

Debra Woog [00:19:11] Or another way you could be in a crisis is that you are the point person for a person’s era. So, you’re the spouse of that person. You’re the adult child of that person. You’re the parents of that person. You’re the best friend.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:19:24] Great analogy. Yeah. Yeah.

Debra Woog [00:19:27] Point person often has as much stress and challenge from the experience as the person. Zero. Yeah. And I’ve talked to a lot of people about this. I have been the point person, you know, most of the time in the crises that I’ve experienced. And I feel like it’s a role people don’t get. How much support the point people need to get through?

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:19:53] Yes.

Debra Woog [00:19:54] And then there are Some situations that are. The hardest where Someone is both the person zero and they must be their own point person. I heard a close, close friend from business school who was diagnosed a year, year, and a half ago with breast cancer. Single she lives by herself, and she was the one going through it. And yet she had to be the one to figure out. What are all the treatment options and how do I file for my disability insurance? And where do I go to get the prosthetic breasts? Yeah, she’s had to do So, much. And when I told her, you know, when this started that I was, you know, dedicated and a friend to doing whatever she needed me to do. And I went with her on Face Time during the pandemic. She lives in another city.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:20:54] Mm hmm.

Debra Woog [00:20:55] But I just saw how especially draining it can be. When? Now. And she’s still a year and a half later. Thank goodness she’s free of cancer now, but she’s still doing dealing with all the side effects from the treatments.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:21:09] Oh, gosh.

Debra Woog [00:21:10] Yeah. Still fighting with the disability insurance company to get the payouts from the policy that her employer had paid for. And there’s So, much to deal with.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:21:20] Right.

Debra Woog [00:21:20] So, I just wanted to highlight that, too. I’m here.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:21:23] I’m glad you brought that up. Yeah, we had talked about that, too. And that is such an amazing point because Someone who, like you said, has, you know, they’re sick, they have a disease, and they also, have to do that, be their own point person. They don’t even have time to focus on getting better. You know, they don’t have time to rest or.

Debra Woog [00:21:53] You know.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:21:54] Because they’re So, busy, you know, they must call or email or research. And yeah, I can totally see how that would just be. And that’s stressful. And add a stress adds to whatever disease or that you’re dealing with, you know, and I just love that you remember to point that out. So, you know, anybody who is helping Someone else, you know, you know, you can use this service.

Debra Woog [00:22:24] You might need a crisis navigation partner. I have a client who came to me referred by a friend of mine who had been her coach. Yeah, she was a vice president of a tech company and who she had been with for four years up to this point. But they weren’t married, and they didn’t live together. They considered a partner. He had been diagnosed with glioblastoma six months before she came to me. And we were blessed and was a very aggressive, fast-moving cancer. Wow. She was trying to be everything for him, you know, in sickness and in health, although they hadn’t made those vows. And at the time, she was trying to be the vice president of the function in her company that she runs.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:23:11] And, my goodness.

Debra Woog [00:23:13] And the change that that organization was going through as she just had So, much on her plate. And she was trying to figure out for him what the best nutrition was. And how could you get into this specialist in Boston versus a, well, well-known person for glioblastoma who is also, in a Boston hospital?

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:23:32] Right.

Debra Woog [00:23:33] She had So, much on her plate and they would delegate tasks to me. They would delegate research to me. And wow was helpful for them both, even though I actually have never met him. It was always working directly with her. Right. And I had to be a mirror Sometimes a. Maybe mirror is not the right or the right image, but I need it to reflect back to her. Sometimes you need a break. Yeah. Now to take a break.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:24:11] Yeah.

Debra Woog [00:24:11] Want to sleep in your own bed tonight? And not here. Because you need a good night’s sleep. And you don’t want his giant dog crawling in bed with you. That’s reasonable. And even though you’re scared that he will be here in six months, you need to yourself now. Right. Help! Help him through this next six months. And for yourself.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:24:32] Right, right, right. And she may not have had anybody else being very clear and upfront with her and say, hey, you got to take care of yourself first. You know.

Debra Woog [00:24:43] Everybody else in his family was looking to her to be the point person because they didn’t want to be the point person.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:24:49] Yeah.

Debra Woog [00:24:51] But, you know.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:24:52] So, I mean, have you been helping a client and you’ve just because I would be Someone that would be So, emotionally involved in the situation, you know, their feelings or my feelings or cry. Cry. So, how do you handle that? You know, when you obviously, you know, your friends and you’ve helping them and you’re trying not to, you know. Right down in front of them because you want to be strong for them, you know, how do you handle those moments? You know, because I know this must be a very touching and, you know, situation for you.

Debra Woog [00:25:32] And I am I’m an empath. I really feel other people’s feelings along with them. So, I have had to learn in that, you know, I pivoted my business to hone in more on this and to that in my team. And I really have had to learn since then how to up my own game in terms of self-care and what were my expectations of myself in other areas So, that I could really be there for other people without. Exhausting myself. Yeah, because I get tired. You know, I went through a situation this week with Someone. They’re a 19-year-old who had a psychotic break that was brought on by Some super potent weed that she had smoked.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:26:24] Oh, Lord.

Debra Woog [00:26:24] And, you know, I was with her for about three days. And we are in the hospital getting her treatment and everything she needed. I mean, I was So, tired afterwards. I really mean that early and take care of myself. So, I learned too also, be extra gentle with myself. And I consider that a lot of public service, but a private service to my clients or my loved ones, because they’re more likely to believe that it’s okay for them to go to bed early if they see that I’m doing that. And that’s how I can keep showing up. Right?

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:27:04] Right. That’s great. I mean, you have to be intentional and aware and conscientious of you of yourself in the moment. So, that. Okay, I’m almost to my breaking point here, you know. I need to step away and go take care of myself. So, I really like that. You recognize that? Because I mean, what you tell other people, if you don’t practice it, then it’s right. No, it’s not going to. Yeah. So, how can people reach out to you, Debra? I know you have a beautiful website.

Debra Woog [00:27:51] Yeah, So, this is a little confusing. So, the name of my business is Connect and then the number two corporation. But on social media and my website, it’s all at connect tw00, that’s my hand on Instagram. That’s my Facebook page. That’s mine dot com. So, if you want to email me, https://connecttwo.com/?doing_wp_cron=1660444471.6364409923553466796875. Those are some good ways to, to get in touch.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:28:20] And you have a free brochure that people can download.

Debra Woog [00:28:26] I do, yeah. On my website. And I also, have a kind of cool tool that is helps people understand when they’re being ah, yeah, that’s my brochure, helps people understand it’s a quiz that helps people understand when they are being competent in a crisis and when they are going too far and working too hard and overcompensating and y. And anyway, with that and it’s under services, there’s a dropdown menu for services on my home field and it takes 10 minutes, but you get back up customized report, and I created this whole thing and I think it’s really neat. I recommend it as a good way to get to know because.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:29:08] Definitely because I like to go there and be like, I don’t know if I need anybody, but they take the quiz are like, Oh Lord, I’m in crisis mode. I reach out to Debra.

Debra Woog [00:29:19] They help on the questions, art, on the quizzes. The questions are, are you in a crisis? But then, you know, how do you handle challenging situations and while you fail afterwards? And what are the causes of this?

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:29:32] Gotcha. Yeah. Well, Debra, I appreciate you So, much for taking the time out to talk to my audience. Motherhood, unfiltered is going to be okay. I talk to mothers who are dealing with anxiety and depression daily, and a lot of those situations arise from being in a crisis, you know, whether it’s being, you know, a divorce, say, or suffering from, you know, a loss of a loved one or just being a single mom, just trying to navigate their life. I have always said I wish now that I had had Someone that I could maybe I always thought of like a loving nanny, you know, that could help me when the boys were younger. But, you know, that’s in the past now. So, now I’m just hoping that people can use these tools to reach out and say, yes, I need your help. So, So, thank you So, much for joining me today. Bye.

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The Grief Process: What to Expect When You’re Going Through Loss

In this blog, Mandy Capehart is going to show you how to create a Restorative Grief Project in your own community. This project is designed to help grievers and grief supporters find healing and hope after a loss. Mandy Capehart is a certified grief and life coach, and she has experienced loss herself. After her mother died in 2016, she realized there was a lack of resources available to help people through their grief. So she decided to create a space where people could share their stories and find support. The Restorative Grief Project is a safe place for people to fall apart and not have any answers. It’s a space where people can share their experiences and learn from each other. If you’re looking for a place to heal after a loss, this blog is for you.

Mandy Capehart is an author, speaker, and certified grief and life coach who helps people find their own values and what’s important to them. She is the founder of the Restorative Grief Project, which is an online community of grievers and grief supporters looking for movement while they heal. Capehart is from the Pacific Northwest and has experienced loss herself, which has driven her to help others facing similar situations.

Mandy Capehart is an author, speaker, and certified grief and life coach. They started the Restorative Grief Project in 2020 in response to the pandemic and the lack of grief literacy in the world. The project is an online community of grievers and grief supporters that provides a safe space for people to fall apart and not have any answers. The goal is to help people find their own values and what’s important to them so they can realign with a centered sense of peace and stillness.

Here are the steps you need to follow to also get Grief literacy.:
1. Grief is normal and natural, and we all experience it differently.

2. There is no right or wrong way to grieve, and there is no timeline for grieving.

3. It is okay to feel uncomfortable emotions and to express them honestly and vulnerably.

1. Grief is normal and natural, and we all experience it differently.
Grief is a normal and natural response to loss, and we all experience it in different ways. There is no one right way to grieve, and there is no timeline for grief. It is important to allow yourself to experience all the emotions and thoughts that come with grief, and to find ways to express yourself that are helpful for you. There is no shame in grief, and it is okay to ask for help if you are struggling.

There are many different stages of grief, and it is normal to go through all of them, or to move back and forth between them. The most cited stages are denial, anger, bargaining, depression, and acceptance. However, it is important to remember that everyone experiences grief differently, and there is no one right way to grieve. It is also important to remember that grief is not a linear process. You may not go through all the stages, or you may not go through them in order. You may also find yourself moving back and forth between stages. That is all normal and okay. Grief is a complex and difficult emotion, and it takes time to work through it. If you are struggling with grief, it is important to reach out for help. Talk to a friend, family member, therapist, or any other support system you have. There is no shame in asking for help, and there are many people who understand what you are going through.

2. There is no right or wrong way to grieve, and there is no timeline for grieving.
There is no right or wrong way to grieve, and there is no timeline for grieving. Grief is an active, engaging process that when you are grieving, you are experiencing the loss kind of firsthand. And the more time we spend being intentional about that, I think the more frequently we will experience those moments of grieving like you were talking about, but it will feel less disruptive. So in a sense of like, if you picture yourself on this path, right, that spirals in on itself. So you start in the center and you’re slowly walking out. You’re going to encounter places that you’ve come by before, but you’re going at it from a different perspective. You’re further out from the center of the event. You can still see and you experience things, but you’re learning more. So you’re kind of expanding and including part of your story that came before you and gaining some insight and applying new versions like the new understanding of who you are, what serves you well and what brings you back into alignment shows up.

So grief is this process that helps us move through and understand our losses. It’s something that is unique to each individual, and there is no one right way to do it. Grieving is an ongoing process, and there is no timeline for it. You might find yourself revisiting certain aspects of your loss as you continue to grow and change. Grief is a natural and necessary part of healing, and it can be a powerful force in our lives.

3. It is okay to feel uncomfortable emotions and to express them honestly and vulnerably.
The third step in the grief process is to begin to accept the loss. This can be a difficult and painful step, but it is a necessary one. In order to move on from grief, we must first accept that the person or thing we lost is gone. This can be a difficult thing to do, but it is important to remember that the pain of grief will eventually fade and we will be able to remember the good times we had with the person or thing we lost.

It is okay to feel uncomfortable emotions and to express them honestly and vulnerably. However, it is important to remember that the pain of grief will eventually fade. In order to move on from grief, we must first accept that the person or thing we lost is gone. This can be a difficult thing to do, but it is important to remember that the good times we had with the person or thing we lost will eventually outweigh the pain of the loss.

If you are grieving, know that you are not alone. Millions of people around the world are grieving at any given time. Grief is a natural response to loss, and there is no right or wrong way to grieve. Take the time you need to heal, and reach out for help if you need it.

I’d love to hear about you and your experience with getting Grief literacy.. Leave me a comment on how it went for you or drop any questions you want me to answer!

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Debra Woog

Debra Woog

Crisis Navigation Partner; Difficult Conversations Expert

Transcript

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Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:00:02] Hello Everybody. This is Nicky Asher-Bowling. From motherhood unfiltered is going to be okay. And today’s guest is Debra Woog. So, whether you’re experiencing your own crises or managing others throughout, there’s she is a crisis navigation partner and can help you determine your goals. Express. Hold on here. Express, you know, complicated situations. So, and before I bring her on, I just want to remind everybody that if you’re watching this on YouTube to like comment and subscribe if you haven’t already. And that will help with the algorithm getting more people to see it. And if you listen on any podcast platform, then please go to Apple at. Apple and then you can write a review there. I don’t know of any other podcast platform that where you can rate your podcast. So, now let me bring Debra on So, we can get to know her. Hi, Debra.

Debra Woog [00:01:34] Good morning. Good afternoon. Yeah.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:01:40] So, Debra, just tell us a little bit about being a crisis navigation partner and how you got started being a crisis navigation partner.

Debra Woog [00:01:55] Okay. So, I have a crisis navigation partner, which is a profession that I basically made up. So, if you haven’t heard of this before, you’re in great company with most of the 7 billion plus people in the world. So, I created the concept of a crisis navigation partner because I have been both a leader and a leadership consultant and coach in situations where I’ve been in crisis or when I was the consultant or coach, where my clients have been in crisis, where they’ve been. And I’ve been a woman who’s a leader and feeling on my own for Some reason, and my clients have been to either because they’re single or they’re only children of the only adult child of parents that they need to take care of, or they are at the top of an organization. It can be lonely at the time; I know for sure. My role is to be that person that I wish that I had and Some of the difficult things that I went through, especially my child’s mental health crisis. Mm hmm. My role is to be that person for my clients where I can provide emotional support combined with practical support. So, I do research on behalf of my clients. I help them strategize for difficult conversations and a lot of listening and teasing out what are the pain points that are personal and what are the pain points that are situational, and how can we guide your way through to the best possible outcome of the situation?

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:03:35] Wow. That’s interesting. I, I love that you. Well, first of all, I didn’t realize that you created this role. And, I mean, how smart is that? I don’t nobody else has done that. So, but I mean, they have Someone that you can reach out to when you’re, you know, in the middle of a crisis. Like, I know when I went through my divorce, I would have loved to have Somebody there to help me with that, you know, because I yeah, I was a stay-at-home mom, you know, and I ended up with having three little boys and. I don’t. The first thing I could think of was, well, I need to get a job. But if I’d had Someone help me, then I could have helped. You know, not only find a job, but also, help the boys transition from being a two-parent home to a one parent home and all of that. It just seems like we. Are always like putting out fires, you know, and stuff like that happens. And then our loved ones are being put to the backburner because we’re just trying to take care of their basic, basic, you know, their basic needs. I really love that. Please explain the steps, you know, like more interest if Someone is lost a loved one and they reach out to you. So, what would be the first thing that you would want to look at?

Debra Woog [00:05:15] Well, initially, I always have a no cost conversation to understand what’s going on for the person and to see how I think I might be able to help these be what they’re looking for. Sometimes it seems like I can’t help, and sometimes it seems like I’m not the right person in those cases. I’m always happy to refer them to Someone else. I have a big connector. I have a network of brilliant women who can provide a lot of different services. So, it starts with kind of the assessment piece. What’s your current situation and what is your ideal best possible outcome given this difficult situation that you’re in?

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:06:03] Oh, okay. I really like that doing an assessment and. I. And Sometimes if Someone’s like me, they’re probably go, I don’t know what the best possible outcome is. You know, because how do you think of that when you’ve lost Somebody, you know?

Debra Woog [00:06:21] Yeah. So, taking that right, I mean, the best possible outcome would be brought them back to life. Okay. I don’t have that power that is not in the job description I made up for myself, although if I had the power, I’d put it right. Other people would like it. I would like it. So, yeah.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:06:38] She’s doing God’s work now.

Debra Woog [00:06:39] So, you. No, I would. I what I do is work with people to define success at this phase of their life. Yeah. And how can they leverage their unique brilliance So, their best skills and interests and qualities, their top needs, their top values, their priorities, how do they leverage all that to create the next phase of life without this person? What kind of support do they need? Right. Kind of. Access. What are the toughest things going on right now? What wouldn’t like that load? What are the big decisions that you’re facing? So, I can’t do that magical thing, right? To help ease Someone into the next phase. And I can help them understand grief better, although I’m not a grief counselor. Go through that before. Right. It’s not linear and it takes So, many different phases and they don’t necessarily go in order. And though Elizabeth Kubler-Ross had all the right ideas and there even she said they didn’t always go from there. Yeah.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:07:53] That’s right.

Debra Woog [00:07:55] So, I see myself as a thought partner as well as an extra pair of hands. I studied psychology in college and then I went to business school. I was an organizational change consultant and a leadership and career consultant for. It’s been 25 years now since I graduated from business school.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:08:14] Right. Right.

Debra Woog [00:08:15] Bringing my own skills and expertise to bear is having gone through all my own difficult situations. I just know how painful it is to be on your own. And Some people have family and friends who can help them through these kinds of things, and that’s great. And people don’t for whatever reason then.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:08:35] Yeah, I do agree with that. I find it more and more that there are people that just don’t have Someone they can turn to. I don’t know if it’s just because they’re not close to people, you know, to their family or whatever. But like for me, I would I know how busy my family is. I would not want to burden them with Something. So, I would probably. Want to reach out and ask for help.  So, what kind of crises have you faced in your life or in your work? I mean, obviously, this is a personal thing for you because you decided to change your whole career to help other people.

Debra Woog [00:09:28] Yeah. I mean, I was I like to think I was helping other people in that, you know, in the earlier parts of my career, too. But I must hone-in one more specifically. That was a switch. It was a clarification for me. But to answer your question, starting with as a kid, my family moved around because of my dad’s job nine times by the time, got more.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:09:53] Of.

Debra Woog [00:09:54] A lot of the United States, and we were constantly having to start over. And, you know, when you’re a kid and you get taken away from your friends, that’s a kind of crisis on its own. Yeah. So, you know, it’s not a tragedy, but it’s hard. Yeah. I have the experience of starting over and building a new community. I mean, I’ve experience of starting over a lot.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:10:19] Yeah. Yeah.

Debra Woog [00:10:21] As I went into my twenties, I lost my best friend from business school to now. I lost my best friend from high school right after I was in business school to AIDS. And before that he had become very suddenly ill, and I helped him, and his partner identify potential treatment options for the diagnosis. Yeah, well, yeah, within that because AIDS is a collection of things, right? I went through that. I got married. I had kids. Those were great things. I got divorced. I became a single mom. My child of two just turned 18 yesterday and in November it’ll be 14 years. Yeah. So, I’ve been a single mom on my own during that time. My Son was diagnosed with type one diabetes, and then my daughter, a few years later, started having severe generalized anxiety disorder now. So, those are Some examples of the crises I’ve personally had. I’ve been very fortunate in a lot of ways in life that I haven’t had a lot more loss people in my life who were younger.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:11:40] Right. I find it interesting that sometimes we go through things, you know, as a child or as a young adult that helps us, like you said, like hone in our redefine our purpose. And those things have helped you with your own personal journey and you and your children, you know, So, and they are better off for it, you know, because you already practiced this in your life. It just makes it easier to help Someone else who’s in the middle of a crisis. And I just really love that concept. I know, like I’ve said before, there’s lots of people that don’t, you know, have Somebody. And I feel like we just need to get this message out there that, hey, you’re not alone. You know, we’ve got Someone here that can help you in this moment of your crisis.  So, what was the defining moment that you were like, this is what I got to be doing. I got to help people when they’re in the middle of a crisis. Was that a defining moment or was it just the, you know, slow revelation or, you know, how did that happen?

Debra Woog [00:13:00] Exactly. Kind of a sudden revelation. It is. Going back to your question about types of crises before. I’ve also, been through my own existential crises. And, you know, what am I doing here? What is my purpose? And I am living where people need me. And I’m I filled from my work. Right. I’ve also, been downsized. You know, I’ve been laid off. I have overseen human resources for a company where I had to lay everybody else off. Gosh, I’ve been through disputes. I’ve coached a lot of other people through various kinds of disputes. So, back to your question now. In around 2017, I started my business in 1999. Around 2017, I went through a kind of a phase that I think I’ve been through. That’s kind of the third time I’ve been through where I felt like, I love having my business. I’m successful. I like my work. But it’s not lighting me up like it used to. I know like what to do. And I am So, excited to show up every day to do it.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:14:06] Yeah.

Debra Woog [00:14:07] Yeah. Well, it wasn’t energizing me the way it used to.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:14:11] Right. Right. Oh, I totally get that.

Debra Woog [00:14:14] And so, I used the tools that I used as a career coach with my clients, some of which had come because I use them in the past in my own existential crises, to think about what would success look and feel like for me, and what were the times in my life that I felt most alive? Most useful.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:14:39] Right?

Debra Woog [00:14:40] Most fulfilled. Mm. And I started making lists. And then I was looking at this whole list of things I went through that Some of them were related to my business and Some of them weren’t new things that I had gone through as a friend or as a loved one of Somebody else.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:14:58] Right.

Debra Woog [00:14:59] And I was like, holy cow. I had have kind of, um, like, there’s been a lot of crisis in my life and in my friends lives. And I am one of these weirdos who kind of goes towards not away from.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:15:15] Your friends or danger.

Debra Woog [00:15:18] I mean, I go tours, like, bungee jumping or anything, but I don’t mean that I don’t love adventure. I’m not a thrill seeker. My dad was a volunteer EMT when I was like that used to bring home the ambulance. Sometimes it was very little like two and three. I remember being. But what my dad to this day listens to a police scanner to relax. I don’t do that. But if Somebody I deeply care about is having an emergency and they come to me, I stop what I’m doing.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:15:55] Right.

Debra Woog [00:15:56] And my dad would, like, follow a fire truck from a safe distance just to watch and see what’s on fire and how they never live. I want to be there for other people. And. I just realized how many times it had come up in situations that I was not creating. I mean, I contributed to my divorce operations in the lives of my clients and friends and family that. It wasn’t making happen. But then when they came and said, I want you by my side during this week.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:16:31] So, yeah.

Debra Woog [00:16:32] Asked me, have asked me to be the executor of their wills. Yeah, I know. And I was going to like. So, you want me in your crisis when you’ve left because.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:16:45] They want you to pick up the pieces.

Debra Woog [00:16:48] I started asking people like, why did you come to me during that? Why, right? Why do you want me to be here in those situations? And I am listening to the themes and that aha moment. Help me. Okay, I get it. What I want to do. And then I had to think about, well, what’s the name for this? Because that’s this thing. And I wanted to be clearer that I wasn’t. Your garden variety career coach or life coach has never resonated with me for my for my work.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:17:23] But yeah.

Debra Woog [00:17:24] For the business coach more than being a leadership coach.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:17:29] Yeah, I love that people are seeing you as a a standard or a pillar, you know, a strong foundation. And they know that even though they may be flying in the wind, they can, you know, link arms with Debra and Debra will hold them, hold on to them, you know, and guide them through the next step that they need to go through. I, I feel like each time well, I would think that each time you would help Somebody that you probably learn Something new. Oh yeah. And, you know, you’re just still continuing to learn and to help others, you know, with the next quiet. The other thing I wanted to mention, and I think it just left my brain because that’s the way it is.

Debra Woog [00:18:22] But I have a thought to mention, if you want, while you’re thinking about what.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:18:27] Yeah, go ahead.

Debra Woog [00:18:30] As I was putting together my kind of own manifesto, but my own ideas about how I wanted to serve and who I wanted to serve. Right. In a crisis, there’s kind of two different roles. Mm hmm. I don’t think that people talk about this in this way. So, again, I made up the language of, you know, better language for this. Please tell me this is what I’m using. In the meantime, you’ve got it in, you’re in a crisis. You are the person zero who’s got kind of the ground zero, the person right in the center of it. This thing is happening to you. You’re getting divorced. You’re lying in the hospital bed. You just got laid off.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:19:08] Yeah.

Debra Woog [00:19:09] Diagnosis, Something like that.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:19:10] Yeah.

Debra Woog [00:19:11] Or another way you could be in a crisis is that you are the point person for a person’s era. So, you’re the spouse of that person. You’re the adult child of that person. You’re the parents of that person. You’re the best friend.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:19:24] Great analogy. Yeah. Yeah.

Debra Woog [00:19:27] Point person often has as much stress and challenge from the experience as the person. Zero. Yeah. And I’ve talked to a lot of people about this. I have been the point person, you know, most of the time in the crises that I’ve experienced. And I feel like it’s a role people don’t get. How much support the point people need to get through?

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:19:53] Yes.

Debra Woog [00:19:54] And then there are Some situations that are. The hardest where Someone is both the person zero and they must be their own point person. I heard a close, close friend from business school who was diagnosed a year, year, and a half ago with breast cancer. Single she lives by herself, and she was the one going through it. And yet she had to be the one to figure out. What are all the treatment options and how do I file for my disability insurance? And where do I go to get the prosthetic breasts? Yeah, she’s had to do So, much. And when I told her, you know, when this started that I was, you know, dedicated and a friend to doing whatever she needed me to do. And I went with her on Face Time during the pandemic. She lives in another city.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:20:54] Mm hmm.

Debra Woog [00:20:55] But I just saw how especially draining it can be. When? Now. And she’s still a year and a half later. Thank goodness she’s free of cancer now, but she’s still doing dealing with all the side effects from the treatments.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:21:09] Oh, gosh.

Debra Woog [00:21:10] Yeah. Still fighting with the disability insurance company to get the payouts from the policy that her employer had paid for. And there’s So, much to deal with.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:21:20] Right.

Debra Woog [00:21:20] So, I just wanted to highlight that, too. I’m here.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:21:23] I’m glad you brought that up. Yeah, we had talked about that, too. And that is such an amazing point because Someone who, like you said, has, you know, they’re sick, they have a disease, and they also, have to do that, be their own point person. They don’t even have time to focus on getting better. You know, they don’t have time to rest or.

Debra Woog [00:21:53] You know.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:21:54] Because they’re So, busy, you know, they must call or email or research. And yeah, I can totally see how that would just be. And that’s stressful. And add a stress adds to whatever disease or that you’re dealing with, you know, and I just love that you remember to point that out. So, you know, anybody who is helping Someone else, you know, you know, you can use this service.

Debra Woog [00:22:24] You might need a crisis navigation partner. I have a client who came to me referred by a friend of mine who had been her coach. Yeah, she was a vice president of a tech company and who she had been with for four years up to this point. But they weren’t married, and they didn’t live together. They considered a partner. He had been diagnosed with glioblastoma six months before she came to me. And we were blessed and was a very aggressive, fast-moving cancer. Wow. She was trying to be everything for him, you know, in sickness and in health, although they hadn’t made those vows. And at the time, she was trying to be the vice president of the function in her company that she runs.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:23:11] And, my goodness.

Debra Woog [00:23:13] And the change that that organization was going through as she just had So, much on her plate. And she was trying to figure out for him what the best nutrition was. And how could you get into this specialist in Boston versus a, well, well-known person for glioblastoma who is also, in a Boston hospital?

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:23:32] Right.

Debra Woog [00:23:33] She had So, much on her plate and they would delegate tasks to me. They would delegate research to me. And wow was helpful for them both, even though I actually have never met him. It was always working directly with her. Right. And I had to be a mirror Sometimes a. Maybe mirror is not the right or the right image, but I need it to reflect back to her. Sometimes you need a break. Yeah. Now to take a break.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:24:11] Yeah.

Debra Woog [00:24:11] Want to sleep in your own bed tonight? And not here. Because you need a good night’s sleep. And you don’t want his giant dog crawling in bed with you. That’s reasonable. And even though you’re scared that he will be here in six months, you need to yourself now. Right. Help! Help him through this next six months. And for yourself.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:24:32] Right, right, right. And she may not have had anybody else being very clear and upfront with her and say, hey, you got to take care of yourself first. You know.

Debra Woog [00:24:43] Everybody else in his family was looking to her to be the point person because they didn’t want to be the point person.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:24:49] Yeah.

Debra Woog [00:24:51] But, you know.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:24:52] So, I mean, have you been helping a client and you’ve just because I would be Someone that would be So, emotionally involved in the situation, you know, their feelings or my feelings or cry. Cry. So, how do you handle that? You know, when you obviously, you know, your friends and you’ve helping them and you’re trying not to, you know. Right down in front of them because you want to be strong for them, you know, how do you handle those moments? You know, because I know this must be a very touching and, you know, situation for you.

Debra Woog [00:25:32] And I am I’m an empath. I really feel other people’s feelings along with them. So, I have had to learn in that, you know, I pivoted my business to hone in more on this and to that in my team. And I really have had to learn since then how to up my own game in terms of self-care and what were my expectations of myself in other areas So, that I could really be there for other people without. Exhausting myself. Yeah, because I get tired. You know, I went through a situation this week with Someone. They’re a 19-year-old who had a psychotic break that was brought on by Some super potent weed that she had smoked.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:26:24] Oh, Lord.

Debra Woog [00:26:24] And, you know, I was with her for about three days. And we are in the hospital getting her treatment and everything she needed. I mean, I was So, tired afterwards. I really mean that early and take care of myself. So, I learned too also, be extra gentle with myself. And I consider that a lot of public service, but a private service to my clients or my loved ones, because they’re more likely to believe that it’s okay for them to go to bed early if they see that I’m doing that. And that’s how I can keep showing up. Right?

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:27:04] Right. That’s great. I mean, you have to be intentional and aware and conscientious of you of yourself in the moment. So, that. Okay, I’m almost to my breaking point here, you know. I need to step away and go take care of myself. So, I really like that. You recognize that? Because I mean, what you tell other people, if you don’t practice it, then it’s right. No, it’s not going to. Yeah. So, how can people reach out to you, Debra? I know you have a beautiful website.

Debra Woog [00:27:51] Yeah, So, this is a little confusing. So, the name of my business is Connect and then the number two corporation. But on social media and my website, it’s all at connect tw00, that’s my hand on Instagram. That’s my Facebook page. That’s mine dot com. So, if you want to email me, https://connecttwo.com/?doing_wp_cron=1660444471.6364409923553466796875.

Those are some good ways to, to get in touch.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:28:20] And you have a free brochure that people can download.

Debra Woog [00:28:26] I do, yeah. On my website. And I also, have a kind of cool tool that is helps people understand when they’re being ah, yeah, that’s my brochure, helps people understand it’s a quiz that helps people understand when they are being competent in a crisis and when they are going too far and working too hard and overcompensating and y. And anyway, with that and it’s under services, there’s a dropdown menu for services on my home field and it takes 10 minutes, but you get back up customized report, and I created this whole thing and I think it’s neat. I recommend it as a good way to get to know because.

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:29:08] Definitely because I like to go there and be like, I don’t know if I need anybody, but they take the quiz are like, Oh Lord, I’m in crisis mode. I reach out to Debra.

Debra Woog [00:29:19] They help on the questions, art, on the quizzes. The questions are, are you in a crisis? But then, you know, how do you handle challenging situations and while you fail afterwards? And what are the causes of this?

Nicky Asher-Bowling [00:29:32] Gotcha. Yeah. Well, Debra, I appreciate you So, much for taking the time out to talk to my audience. Motherhood, unfiltered is going to be okay. I talk to mothers who are dealing with anxiety and depression daily, and a lot of those situations arise from being in a crisis, you know, whether it’s being, you know, a divorce, say, or suffering from, you know, a loss of a loved one or just being a single mom, just trying to navigate their life. I have always said I wish now that I had had Someone that I could maybe I always thought of like a loving nanny, you know, that could help me when the boys were younger. But, you know, that’s in the past now. So, now I’m just hoping that people can use these tools to reach out and say, yes, I need your help. Thank you so much for joining me today. Bye.

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Less Is The New More!

concentrated woman carrying stack of cardboard boxes for relocation

I have been focusing on decluttering, and why should we declutter? How does decluttering affect our lives? Growing up, I had never heard of decluttering, we did spring cleaning. When mom made us pull out furniture, of the house, we cleaned it got rid of the trash got rid of clothes, we did every year. And, and then as I had my own home. I did it with my kids were yet here. But somehow, I lost the whole thing of decluttering or spring cleaning. I lost the gumption. I am finding spring cleaning, or decluttering it helps you mentally, emotionally. And I do not want to say physically, I am trying to figure out why how it would fit in there. I mean, it keeps you more active in your house.

When I had stuff in my home, I did not know where to put it. When I told someone to put something away. They did not know where to put it. We did not have enough house to put stuff.

Last year, when I started on my journey of making changes, and deciding to do things differently, instead of focusing on my harmful stuff, and feeling sorry for myself, I decided to work on the things in my life I have control over. One of the things I focused on was our home and the areas stressing me out. I made a list and I started with my kitchen. Trust me, I am not an expert at this, but I have been learning as I go, as you decide to focus on an area in your house, to me is also focusing on something like in my mind and my heart. To me, those were working side by side together.

The main thing was realizing I do not have control over everything. What I do have control over then what gave me my little victories along this journey. People are like, why do I need to declutter? I cannot give up on this stuff. I mean, this is a perfectly good outfit. Yeah, I have only worn it once, or I only wear it when I go to a concert. The thing of it is, I love my possessions and trust me I struggle with it too. I have clothes my little baby boys wore, they were itty bitty, I touch it and it brings back those special memories.

In the progress you must work through it. What you need to do is pick a place in the house, which was my kitchen. I was able to go through and get rid of the things was easy to get rid of, when I had three of the same bowl, well, I only needed one. I was able to get rid of two, I did not need three of them. It also made me feel good I was able to give, donate our stuff we were not using a nonprofit Christian place. They were able to help families out who had been, affected by fires or whatever the situation is. But it made me feel good I had nice things to donate. I kept thinking I spent this much money on it, I should sell it. If you are a go getter, and you have stuff, you want to sell it, and ship it out, go ahead. But for me, I know myself well enough to know if I did not get rid of it. I could post it on social media, try to sell it. But if I did not get rid of it at once, or soon I was not going to at all. And the reason I know it because I decided to sell my shoes, I had a ton of nice shoes. I took nice pictures, I staged them, and I posted them on social media. And I gave my prices and, nobody ever purchased them. What happens when no one purchases your stuff? You still have it. I was like, well, that is not going to work. I had a terrible experience on Facebook marketplace, people were getting mad at me. I was like, this is too much stress for me. I blocked everybody and took down my stuff. I will donate them and that is what I did.

One of the good things about decluttering is too study and learn. I have been listening to books, I have been watching videos, there are other moms out there struggling, like I am about getting rid of this stuff. There is good advice out there on how to approach decluttering. The best thing for me to do was set aside what I did not want, if I could not make up my mind to keep it or get rid of it. I kept it for the time being and I kept going with stuff I knew right off the bat I could decide. Yes, I want this; No, I do not want this is how I approached it. I am going to do this decluttering thing or Spring cleaning. And it is going to be the only time I do it because, you get rid of all this stuff.

It felt good to get the stuff out of my house, the missions place I called, came, and picked everything up. They were excited to get it, I could not believe it. I got the kitchen done. I got my office done, I went through my clothes, I went through my clothes three times.

Now the hardest thing I went through, for me to go through with my books. I have always been an avid reader. However, as I have gotten older, I mostly listen to books, and listen to podcasts. It was hard for me to go through books and decide what to get rid of. I categorize my books; I categorize ones special to me. I categorize books my literature books. The hard part was the literature books I love to read I kept the ones had made some kind of an impression on my life and I like to read the technical books, I get rid of those because technical books, and what I mean by, or like your manuals, those are those outdated, and like if you have a technical book for school, I mean, inner expensive. I right away, I started I started buying used or renting my books, unless it was a literature book. Then I purchased one outright. Technical books and manuals. Data they expire or outdate fast. With today’s technology, though, you can go online and get an updated version or see a video of someone doing process. It made it easy for me to say, see ya. Anyway, I cut my books down to one bookshelf. And now I have, more space in my office, my kitchen, my clothes, and my books, those areas were really bothering me.

The whole point of all this is going through the process of letting go, it is hard to not be in control, it is hard to get rid of the stuff in your house. At one point, it was something special to you, or to your kids or whoever, or it was a gift from somebody. I have always been one that is like, if you have it, you use it, you do not waste it, you keep it in case you need it for the future. My new mindset is I have now is if I am not using it, on a regular basis, it must go. I should donate it and give it to someone who does not have it anything like at all and could use it. I still have ways to go, and I am still learning this to I tried to correlate the cleaning and decluttering with mice, self-learning, and my journey. And getting rid of the extra out of my, the dirt in the gunk and the bad and the hatefulness and the grouchiness and short tempered, which, I do not know if I will ever get rid of all stuff. But, I guess, if you are aware of it, and you keep working on it, and it makes you, to be a better person. This is my take on decluttering.

Less is the new more. And to me what it means is less as a new more is the less stuff and clutter in your house. You have more time for yourself, you have more time to spend with your husband, and you have more time to spend with your family. And you have more time to improve yourself, I am it has been it has been wonderful I was able to get a new position at my work which I love it. There are other things I will be talking about, you can hear it on my podcast, and I talked about decluttering because it has been the most stressful thing for me to have to physically deal with. There are people who deal with other problems but do not have any trouble with decluttering.

The first step is, recognizing there is a problem in your life, when you are depressed, sad, feel like you are out of control. You do not know what to do, then you can, what are the things I can work on, and focus on to make my life better my situation better? Kind of what started all this for me. And I feel it has not been easy, it was hard. Because all I wanted to do was cry and sit on the couch and try to watch TV to get rid of my sorrows., I kept doing it a little at a time, I asked God to help me because I knew I could not do this on my own. I did get a support group and there are groups out there for you if you need one. My mentor offers a 15-minute call. I did not know if she could help me, but I knew I needed somebody to help me because I feel like I am drowning over here. It was the best thing I ever did. Which is why I am offering a free call to if you are interested in a free call, you can click on my Facebook page or in the YouTube. I have all my links listed. And you can schedule a 15-minute call. Whatever situation you are in, and you are in a funk, and you are like, I get out of this funk, I am here for you.

I know when I was a young adult, I did not want to reach out because I was ashamed, embarrassed, because I felt like I was in a situation where it was not okay, to be sad or depressed. It was not okay to have problems in your marriage. It was not to okay to have to yell at your kids because they are a bunch of crazy heathens, I mean, it was not okay not to have a clean house, it was not okay not to fix dinner. It took me a long time to realize it is okay, stuff happens to people. The situation I went through was out of my control, I felt like it was my fault. Do not get me wrong, I am not an easy person to live with. Those were things I am responsible for and only I can change. I think people do not realize they have a support system. If you feel like you do not have a support system, you need to reach out.

This is my decluttering story. And if you need help with stress in your life, if you are depressed, and stressed out, like I have been, then contact me, I can help you. We can do this together. We can work through this together, reach out.